"We Know How the Machines Work and We're Able to Take Control:" An Interview with Fugazi's Guy Picciotto (con.)

Scott Thill

ST: I think people don't have a musical ear sometimes and they're just looking to jump around and beat stuff up. I remember the review for Killtaker and it was like, "Same old same old." Then I listened to it and went, "Whoa!" It was much different for me than Repeater or your earlier stuff.

The record that turned it around. "I think that the process of building up the knowledge, from Red Medicine on, we felt that we could produce the records ourselves. We know how the machines work and we're able to take control."

GP: Right. For me, I feel all of the records differently. I don't spend a lot of time listening to them. But I definitely think from Red Medicine on, we took a turn because we felt a lot more confident about producing the records ourselves. That for us was a big shift, because before that I think we felt intimidated in the studio because it was one of the few things where we weren't in control of how everything worked. Because we didn't know. And I think that the process of building up the knowledge, from Red Medicine on, we felt that we could produce the records ourselves. We know how the machines work and we're able to take control. I think that's been the shift, for sure.

ST: Now that Napster's dead, I think that the RIAA is going after a bunch of other peer-to-peer sharing networks. What are your thoughts on file sharing and piracy?
GP: We have completely no problem with file sharing. We just consider it the exchanging of tapes. And we've always had a really open policy about our stuff -- when people come to our shows, we tell them to bring cameras, bring tape recorders, bring video recorders, we don't care. People can come in and tape our gigs and they can trade them. We're not into when people sell our shit as bootlegs and try to make a profit off of it. We think that's a different line that's being crossed.

But when it's just the music being shared, that's what it's about to us. It's not like we get a lot of radio airplay. File sharing is our radio; that's the way people hear our stuff. I think people underestimate the enthusiasm of people who dig music -- they dig it because they want to hear it, not because they want to steal it. It's not like there's this vicarious thieving thrill; they're into the music; it's an enthusiasm for the sound.

ST: They just want to get the word out.
GP: Yeah, exactly. They download your stuff, they dig it, they go out and buy the record. We never shared in the industry freakout about it because it's not important to us. Our main thing has always been access to our music, making it as easy as possible, making it as cheap as possible, so why would we have any problem with file sharing? It's redundant.

ST: You guys also seem to be one of the only outfits that put their postpaid prices on their CDs so shoppers can see how screwed they're getting by the megachains.
GP: Yeah, I think that's really important. For a lot of people, they see a record they like in the store and they're willing to pay the extra money for it because it's convenient. But I think it's important for them to know that if they go to our Web site, they can get the stuff fast, cheap, and efficiently. That's really important to us. You've got ten bucks, you can get the CD -- it'll be mailed to you for that much money. If people want to buy it in chain stores, that's their option, but they pay for that convenience.

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ST: Yeah, if you go to a Virgin Megastore, you'll find a CD for $18.99 with a Fugazi CD next to it for $13.99. And people will wonder why it's so cheap. It's because the price of what the Fugazi CD costs is on the back of it.
GP: Yeah, the economics of CD production is insane, because it costs nothing to make those things. They're cheaper than hell. It probably costs twenty-five cents to manufacture a CD and a little bit more for the artwork. And all that extra money you're paying the major label is stuff is to finance their ridiculously bloated industry. It's ridiculous.

ST: Speaking of the bloated industry, now we've got a lot of Britney Spears and boy bands in the mainstream, which is kind of exciting for me. Because what'll happen sometimes is that people will look to the mainstream and find nothing that speaks to them. And then they'll go digging for stuff like Fugazi and Three Mile Pilot, who are just sitting there waiting to be discovered.
GP: Definitely. People lament the music that's coming out but to me, it's always been the same to a certain degree. I can remember the first time I heard this famous punk band called The Adverts on a college radio station. I was just like, "What the hell is this?" It just felt raw, and I had seen a bunch of arena rock concerts, like Kiss and Aerosmith, you know? And then the first time I saw a punk band in a small room, there was a difference of intensity to it that was so extreme for me. And I think that happens to people all the time. You meet a person or you go into a record store and there are moments that you'll never forget where you are clued into something that you'll never forget, that'll change your life. And it's awesome when it happens. And if it happens for people with our music, it's incredible.

ST: Maybe because you're not in a big arena with a product on the stage. In the small rooms, you can see everyone sweat.
GP: I will say this. I saw KISS and AC/DC and I thought they were incredible. I thought the shows were amazing. But once I saw the Cramps in a small room, there was a difference between the experiences. One was like a Siegfried and Roy explosion and one was something that was intense and real.

So I see the value of the bombast of the big shows. I love them and I thought that they were incredible, but I think that there is something more real and immediate about the other stuff.

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Scott Thill -- a media fanatic who finds the time to write on everything that does not include the words "boy band" -- is a gainfully employed dotcom editor currently finishing his first novel, The Dangerous Perhaps.